Q: Today is Saturday, August 12th 2003 and my name is Delores Cuffey and I’m going to be interviewing Mrs. Nola T. Matthews. What area of Isle of Wight County did you grow up in?
A: I grew up more or less in a little area that’s called Shanty Town, out of Carrsville.
Q: Okay, how many brothers and sisters did you have?
A: Well, count them, uh. You see my father’s been married twice, so therefore, he had three children by his first marriage and then it was five by the second marriage.
Q: Okay and what school did you attend?
A: I attended Mitchell School.
Q: Was it a one room or two room?
A: It was a two-room school.
Q: Could you share some information on how the school got started?
A: It got started by the Mitchells. That’s why it was named Mitchell School. First of all, the Mitchells build a little one room shanty-like for our classes and after, I guess when the county took over, that’s when they build the next school, which is a- which was a two room school down the road a little bit further from where the first school originally was.
Q: Was the named changed?
A: No, the name was not changed. The name was, it still Mitchell School.
Q: Okay, so it started off like a one-room?
A: A one-room shanty like. It was a, it’s still there but it’s more or less has grown up around it, so you can vaguely see it.
Q: Do you remember how many teachers you had?
A: Well, from the time I was there, we only had like maybe three teachers and that was Mrs. Mitchell herself and then it was Mrs. Wells and also Mrs. Lucille Stokes.
Q: Okay, do you remember what the grades were? Was it one through three?
A: In the first room, they had, like, from the first grade through the fourth grade and then fifth, sixth and seventh grades were in the next room.
Q: Okay, can you remember what year, about what year this was?
A: I would say I was there in like ’41, ’42.
Q: Okay. How did you get to and from school?
A: We walked. We walked.
Q: What did you do if the weather was bad?
A: We walked. I don’t want to get excited, but I just tell you like it is; we walked.
Q: But you went to school?
A: We went to school. It was my parents’ determination that we had to go to school.
Q: Okay. Did you have chores in the morning before you went to school?
A: Sure, chickens had to be fed, cows had to be fed. Things like that.
Q: Okay. What about when you got home from school?
A: Same thing. Chores to be done. Things to be done got. Wood to be brought into the house for fire.
Q: How far do you think it was to walk to school? About, about how many miles?
A: I’m going to estimate it at at least three miles, that was twice a day going and coming back.
Q: When you got to school, what were some of the first things you did? How did the school day start once you got there?
A: Okay, first of all, if it was in the winter months, the boys along with the girls, they had to get a fire started and afterwards, we’d start our class. Before class was started, we had a devotion, spiritual, religious devotion.
Q: At school.
A: At school.
Q: That’s a lot different from now, isn’t it?
A: I should say it is and I, well, anyway.
Q: You can elaborate.
A: Well, anyway, what I was going to say was, and maybe that’s why…we had little fights at school, sure, but we didn’t have any shootings and killings and maybe because we had God inside and asked Him every morning to watch over us.
Q: Exactly. Do you remember some of the subjects that were taught, like, did you have spelling, English? What do you remember?
A: Okay, I remember we had spelling, we had English, we had math, we had history, we had geography, and sometimes because of the amount of children, and the amount of grades, the number of grades, you weren’t able; the teacher was not able to get around to every grade, every day history, every grade, every day math. It had its advantages and its disadvantages because lots of times she combined the class, whereas, you might have been a fifth grade student, you were getting sixth grade or seventh grade English, or sixth and seventh grade math.
Q: What about your text books and things that you needed, like pencils and stuff, did you buy, your parents buy them or the school?
A: Our parents had to buy those things and I can remember that, like in early fall, the first cattle that was killed, that went to buy books and pencils and things that the children needed for school.
Q: What time did your school day start? What was your hours? Do you remember?
A: I can remember we always had to be there, that bell rang at 9 o’clock. Our classes began at 9:00 and I think we went until like 3:30.
Q: Okay. What about the months? Was the school like now? School started like, in September?
A: Yes, as I remember, school started in September and we were out in May.
Q: In May? Okay. Do you remember what was the classroom like? Did you have a....
A: We had a little Peter Pan desk. You know, I guess what I am talking about, a little desk in front of us and you slide in from the side and put your books underneath. Some had books, I mean had desks that was on top of the writing part. You know, you slide them in there.
Q: Okay. What did you do like in winter time when you had coats or whatever? Did you have somewhere to put your coats or did you put them on your?
A: I can recall there was always a hallway that you walked in first, and they had little handles like racks where you hung your coats up.
Q: What did you do for lunch? Do you remember?
A: We took a lunch. Everybody took a lunch from home.
Q: Did you eat in like, in the classroom?
A: Eat in the classroom.
Q: Okay. Do you remember having recesses? What did you all do?
A: Oh yeah, we had recess. That was the best time of the whole school time because that’s the time we played. We played all types of ring plays. We did baseball, softball, whatever you might call it.
Q: What do you remember about the teacher’s desk? Did she have...?
A: She just had a normal desk, almost like you see places now. You know, I mean the desks with drawers down the side and everything. She never worried about her desk, because nobody would go and mess with anything on her des- not in her desk.
Q: What about the looks in the classroom, did you all have blackboards?
A: We had blackboards that would go around the room like. For regular holidays, it was, I guess it was stencils that we used to do the erasers. Stencils and that would make that picture and you would color it in. Children took pride in doing that and they would color in whatever holiday; like Santa Claus for Christmas and pumpkins for Thanksgiving or Halloween and things like a turkey. I can remember doing that.
Q: What, for water, did you, what did you all do for water?
A: Well, we walked, not a long, long way, but we walked all the way back to the old school to get water seeing as they had a better well than what they had at the school that we were attending at that time, the second Mitchell School. They had a better well. So we would walk back there and get the water.
Q: The bathrooms?
A: They were outside toilets.
Q: What type of lighting did you have, did you have electricity?
A: No, no electricity, but, you know during the daytime you probably didn’t need any extra light; but if there was something going on during the night, they’d just use lamps. You know, kerosene lamps. That’s where the lighting came from.
Q: What about studying like at home, did you all study?
A: Oh yes, we definitely studied at home, but again, we had lamp light. Very few people had electricity.
Q: Can you remember if you did something bad at school or in the classroom, what kind of punishment did you get?
A: It was according to your, well, crime, I would call it. It really wasn’t a crime, but it was according to what you did. For some of the things you got spanked in your hands. Some of the things you got switched on your legs. It was a lot different then.
Q: Was there a problem with the parents with the teacher doing that?
A: No, there wasn’t because nine times out of ten when the child got home, they got another one.
Q: That probably made a lot of difference then?
A: I’m sure it did.
Q: Can you remember any experience you had walking to school or at school that really sticks out in your mind; something happened with you and another student, or you and the teacher? Can you remember something that really sticks out?
A: Well, not so much with the children because, you know, anytime you get a group of children together, you going to always have a spat, a hit and a run or this, that and the other with children, but one of the things that sticks out in my mind is how we were treated by the white kids that was riding buses. They would save all their trash to throw on us when they, you know, would come by us and the driver himself, if it’s a rainy, bad day and most of the roads then were dirt roads, and they would, he would seem like he would just wait just to get right by us and you know, mash down the gas, just spin the wheels just to make sure we got good and muddy. Things like that, I never will forget one day, one of my friends, she was very spiteful and she decided this is my day and she had herself a nice long switch and when this person on the bus held his head out and put his arms out to throw things on us, she presented him with a switch all the way as far as she could reach coming back and I heard from one of the girls on the bus that he cried all the way home. So that’s one of the things that really sticks out in my mind that happened.
Q: If you could or would, what would you tell a child today who’s going to school knowing, you know, what you went through and the chances they have for now? What would your advice be for a child?
A: My advice for all children: Go to school and don’t go there just to take up the teacher’s time and to waste your time. Go there, put everything in its place and really do your best. Your best may not be all A’s, your best may not be all B’s, but make sure you do your best, and don’t stop with the high school scene. Go as far as you can.
Q: Do you think the teachers then, did they, do you think they did all they could in the situation they were in or the circumstance?
A: Well, under the circumstances, some teachers really did. I know this from experience because like I said, then I was at Mitchell School. Mrs. Mitchell was my teacher and she just advised us all to do all we could. Yes, when I finished the little Mitchell School, which was seventh grade, I went to I.C. Norcom in Portsmouth. How I got there, my brother was married, and he was living there, and I had no choice other than to walk like I’d say five good miles all by myself to get a bus to go to Smithfield. So therefore, I went to Portsmouth and lived with my brother and I went to I.C. Norcom High School, and they were so impressed with the English that I had been taught. The kids in the eighth grade then, so many of them didn’t even know the eight parts of speech and they were the city kids and I had gone to the little Mitchell School, but she had taught me. I tried to learn everything I possibly could and I knew all this stuff. You know eight parts of speech. I could go through them like nothing. I could call them out in my sleep and she said, you know they was so impressed, and this particular teacher, which was named Miss Adams, she did not believe in exempting nobody from a English exam. I was exempted from every English exam in her room. That’s because I knew this stuff. Mrs. Mitchell had taken the time to teach, and during that time teachers taught and they didn’t let children control that classroom. They controlled it.
Q: Right. That is really interesting. How would you, if you could give a brief biography of your life or you and your family growing up or in adulthood or whatever; a brief biography of your life?
A: Well, I was born in Southampton County and we lived there until I was probably ten or eleven years old. Then we moved to Isle of Wight County and that’s when I began Mitchell School. Okay, after Mitchell School, I attended, graduated I.C. Norcom High School. Then I got married. We had, my husband passed in 2000. We have five kids of our own; a lot but that’s what we had, and we raised two other kids, so really seven in all; I include all of my kids. That is, well that’s not all because my determination was my kids had to do better than I did. Every girl I had, which is four girls, I mean five girls and one boy. Every girl I have has a college degree. It wasn’t easy. It was very hard. It was breaking tough. It was what we wanted. We never went through Social Services. We never went on welfare. We worked. My husband worked and I worked. I retired from Franklin City Health Department in 1995. The very same year my husband was diagnosed with cancer, and of course, he lived until the year 2000 and then he passed. Anyway, I can thank God all my children happy. My son, he refused to, he did not want to even go to high school, but I told him if he lived in my house, he had to bring me a high school diploma. The night he graduated he brought it home and gave it to me and said, “You wanted it worse than I did.” I said, “Matters not who wanted it, what matters to me is who received it. You got it.” He went into the army. He served twelve years. He’s out now. He’s on disability because he has diabetes. Diabetes is something that runs deeply in my family, I’m a diabetic myself. I tried hard to cure myself. I take my medications. I check my blood sugar. I do things that the doctor asks me to do, and that’s all I can do right now. God _______________. So, anyway, he’s on insulin, he’s definitely on insulin. I have a daughter that’s in Kileen, TX. She works for him and, of course, she’s on insulin also, but she does take very good care of herself.
Q: Mrs. Mathews, this has been so interesting and informative. We really appreciate this and at some point in time, when we all finish all of these and get them together, like if your children want to go to the Museum and just pull this up and see it and hear what you have to say; and we really thank you. Is there anything else you would like to tell us?
A: Nothing that I can really think of. If you had a question, I would try to answer it, but other than that.
Q: Well, I think you’ve done really well. Thank you so much.
A: And thank you.